Is the education of civil engineers still up to date?

We invited Michael and Philip Kalkbrenner from “Baustelle Bauwesen” to our first podcast interview. They are pioneers of podcasts in the construction industry.

Link to the episode with the full interview: #015 Podcasts in Construction feat. Philip and Michael from Baustelle Bauwesen

Hosts of “Baustelle Bauwesen” Introduce Themselves

Michael, or Michi, the younger of the two, is a civil engineer and, together with his brother, is a podcaster. He works in an architecture office as a construction supervisor.

Philip is a PhD student at the University of Barcelona and is looking forward very much to his graduation. The podcast “Baustelle Bauwesen” is his passion. He is also a structural engineer.

Way to Civil Engineering

Philip has decided on engineering, based on recommendations from those around him – and is happy about it today. During his studies, he was able to directly apply the knowledge he had learned in an association belonging to Engineers Without Borders.

Michael wanted to apply his skills in maths and physics, and since mechanical engineering seemed uninteresting to him, he decided to study civil engineering. He fondly thinks back to the many experiences during his university days which brought him further and convinced him of civil engineering.

Where is the fascination?

For Michael, it is especially the fact that you can come into contact with civil engineering all over the world. He is happy to be part of this whole and to help shape it in the future.

A fascination that never ends, as Philip adds. With more experience, you can plan and create more and more innovative structures. This also increases the pride in one's own participation in such projects.

There are preferred subjects in all academic studies. What did the brothers like and what didn't they like?

Philip's Achilles' heel was mainly the mechanical subjects. Nevertheless, thanks to his perfectionism, he got good grades here. The subjects that he liked much more, such as road planning, went less well.

Michael remembers that the topics that determine his everyday working life left him completely cool during his studies. Most of all, he enjoyed the subject of structural steel design, because he was allowed to design something himself.

What exactly are they doing now and what do they like about the job of a civil engineer?

As already mentioned, Michael works as a construction supervisor. What he enjoys as a civil engineer is difficult to say, because he is currently busier painting walls and laying carpets in turnkey construction.

Philip's path led him to Barcelona for his doctorate. There, he is currently working on bringing two worlds together: He applies masonry machine learning to historical buildings. Philip really enjoyed this challenge.

What also veers away from the classic civil engineering profession is the podcast. How did this come about?

Although Michael has heard more podcasts, it was ultimately Philip's idea to create their own podcast. The brothers always talked a lot on phone to bridge the distance between Karlsruhe and Barcelona. This often resulted in interesting conversations about the construction industry. Finally, they decided to record these conversations and lines of thought.

As civil engineers, they studied in the 21st century, but not for the 21st century – that's the podcast's slogan. The brothers want to achieve more creative and sustainable impulses and cooperation. To do this, they talk to experienced people and pioneers from the construction industry.

Very few civil engineers have a podcast. As a student, you always need to look around in other subjects to get new ideas.

When you have media affinity, says Philip, it's a great way to inspire others and point things out.

Do the brothers have specific, perhaps entrepreneurial, goals with their podcast, or is it more of a hobby?

The podcast is definitely a hobby, says Michael. The brothers want to remain independent and thus retain their freedoms. Concrete goals are to spread the message and also to complete the training gaps to some extent, as far as possible with the podcast episodes.

How do the brothers work to create new episodes?

Philip reveals how they come up with new ideas. They started with stories about pioneers like Fritz Leonhardt. German building icons who are remarkable for their new and progressive ways of thinking.

Sustainability is also a big issue, as well as the facts about various building materials. They are currently trying to gather a small collective. Some listeners are interested in doing an episode with them. Likewise, people with unconventional careers are introduced; for example, developers of structural databases.

Interested people simply write to the brothers and they often ask to participate in an episode.

Is this usually done via email or also LinkedIn?

It is highly variable, as Philip says. Some guests are usually contacted via email, others via LinkedIn, and some others, such as Jan Knippers, via Instagram.

Who does the topic come from?

Philip explains the procedure. When it comes to the question of whether there is any interest in a joint episode, the topic is not even discussed. After accepting the topic, the guest will receive the script for the episode, which can usually be used without revision.

How much work are you investing there?

For Philip, it is at least 10 hours a week. Michael has a little less time to spare, because of his full-time job, but they both work on their podcast every night.

Which episode did the brothers like or remember most?

Michael immediately thinks of the episode with Ove Arup, who has even become his role model.

Philip particularly remembers the episode on circular construction with Angela Fledman ndash; the first guest on the podcast. Many good ideas came out of the conversation.

Dlubal Podcast covers digital and innovative topics in construction. How do the brothers see the future in this industry in general?

Michael talks about realistic and utopian versions of the future. According to him, the realistic assumption is that it will be important in the future to convert buildings instead of building more, and to behave more logically and sustainably.

Peter agrees and adds that the new generation and also young adults are already pursuing similar goals with architects for the future, for example. Now, we need to work towards climate goals – also in the construction industry.

Can the construction industry really change that quickly?

Michael refers to the nature of a construction site as the reason for the slow development. When it comes to digitization, the Internet is still the biggest problem. This development is difficult, because the architect, client, civil engineer, and the contractor all have their own interests.

Philip points out that digitization is advancing slowly in Germany, because things are only brought onto the market if you are sure that they will work. Too clear role distribution and the gap between the older and younger generations also causes slower digitization.

Digitization also stands for some key technologies and for new trends. How do the brothers feel about new trends in construction?

Michael thinks 3D printed houses are incredibly interesting and threatening at the same time. Optimal utilization of material is a big step forward. On the other hand, more resources would be consumed and a negative impact on the environment would be created, which is why the connection with sustainable products is very exciting.

Philip made the connection to his field of work, to machine learning. It has great potential to replace working with formulas that only very few people can understand. Today's engineers would have to develop a key technology that can be used to identify static or dynamic buildings from the existing data without formulas.

Many programs have already implemented optimizing algorithms. This is the development of the future.

Philip mentions the diagrams and tables with empirically determined data that everyone knows from studies or work. In the meantime, this can be done numerically and the dependencies can be deduced from the existing data.

How do they see BIM – Building Information Modeling?

Michael quotes Kim Löffler, who was also a guest on the podcast: BIM is not just a program, it's a way of working. The BIM technology is already available, it only really needs to be used now.

In his opinion, BIM is one of the key technologies that will also facilitate communication, and thus lead to a more sustainable future.

Philip adds that everyone should understand the purpose of it and how it makes cooperation easier.

The future remains exciting. Let's see which prognoses we have made here will become reality. Finally: What is Michael and Peter's favorite building?

Michael's favorite building is the Pantheon in Rome, about which he also made a series of buildings. The different types of concrete used and the fact that it was the largest dome structure in the world for 1,700 years and is still standing today, 2,000 years later, make it an impressive structure.

For Peter, the choice is difficult, but Gaudi's Sagrada Família is particularly close to his heart. The architectural style is typical of the Spanish Mediterranean region. He also likes the buildings by Guastavino very much, such as Grand Central Station in New York, built of thin, light bricks with perfect use of material.

Which brings us back to the topic: Optimizing structures so that they are used in the best possible way for their properties.